A conversation that bothered me
“What most Christians can’t do is have transparent, authentic relationships with non-Christians.”
When Jim Henderson said this last Thursday in our Buckhead Church leadership team meeting, it immediately bothered me. I think the reason it did is because it’s probably true.
Jim Henderson (no relation) is the author of Jim and Casper go to church: Frank conversations about Faith, Churches and Well-meaning Christians. He also founded Church Raters, which pays non-believers to attend and rate churches. http://blog.buckheadchurch.org/2010/02/23/hiring-atheists/
I invited him to meet with our team to discuss his thoughts on how the Church can better engage with those who don’t know Christ. It was a fascinating hour-and-a-half conversation that encouraged and bothered me, all in good ways. Here’s an example of what I mean: When churches ask Jim to speak, he asks them to find non-believing friends in their community who might be willing to be interviewed as a part of his presentation. Jim gives the churches several weeks in advance to begin their search. And then, usually, the church calls a few days before Jim is to speak letting him know they can’t find any non-believers to be interviewed. I had to clarify this with a question. “You mean they can’t find any non-believers or they don’t know any non-believers”? I asked.
Jim smiled and that’s when he said, “What most Christians can’t do is have transparent, authentic relationships with non-Christians.”
Is Jim right? Is it true that most Christians can’t or don’t have transparent relationships with non-Christians? If so, what do we need to do to change this?
I’ll share more details of our conversation with Jim over the next few days here on the blog, but today I think we need to stop and discuss this. What do you think?
Jeff
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Christiansposted
jun 29, 2010by Buckhead Church




June 29, 2010 at 1:52 pm
I don’t think most Christians can have transparent, authentic relationships w/ other Christians, let alone non-Christians…
June 29, 2010 at 1:52 pm
i think it’s absolutely true. the core of our existence as christians is not shared by non christians.
June 29, 2010 at 1:58 pm
I don’t know what a transparent, authentic relationship is!
June 29, 2010 at 2:00 pm
I agree. Sometimes I think that the thing that keeps people from Christ are Christians.
July 25, 2010 at 10:18 pm
I agree
June 29, 2010 at 2:00 pm
I kind of see the point of this statement. It seems like we are trying to sell something to non-believers.Heaven forbid we should admit that life after accepting Christ is not always sunshine and roses.It is easier to push kumbaya Christianity than to explain the nitty gritty life change that comes with a real relationship with Christ.I am not saying we do a bait and switch but maybe sometimes we do gloss over the “real” meaning of following Christ.
June 29, 2010 at 2:08 pm
I do find that problem a lot. I have friendships with many non-Christians, but my problem remains that when I speak of my faith at all, they tune out or walk away. Because God is the center of everything I do, they have a hard time grasping that the things I do aren’t for me or about me. I don’t do something solely for my own benefit any longer, and it frustrates them.
I can’t have a transparent relationship with non-Christians because when I am transparent, I am abandoned. Which pretty much ends the relationship.
June 29, 2010 at 7:33 pm
There’s blame and potential on both sides, for sure.
July 12, 2010 at 10:41 am
I would have to agree with you totally on this one… I too, have relationships with non-Christians… but like you, my life revolves around Christ and when I speak of Him, I get tuned out some or they tell me I am too much into Christ. Forgive me if you must; but I don’t believe there is any way a person can be TO MUCH into Christ…
I am a Christ follower.. He is my world.
June 29, 2010 at 2:12 pm
I think it absolutely is possible! I can state that from my own experience.
There are a couple of friends of mine who are no Christians but our relationship is very deep( sometimes I even feel they can understand certain things better than my Christian friends)
It really depends on how we behave when we are around them. I m no different to them than to the others. It takes time and trust and a lot of sensibility to know when you can lead the direction to God in a conversation or point out a Christian point of view. It is not easy but definitely worth it. I realized it only works when I m patient, praying, honest (to God, them and me).It actually deepened my relationship to God as I needed to find answers for non-Christians that they could understand and accept w/o Christian language etc. Sometimes we make a fool out of ourselves by the way we talk or share our thoughts.It’s really about putting it together for everyone to understand….
June 29, 2010 at 7:35 pm
patient, praying, honest. Good list, Carol.
June 29, 2010 at 2:16 pm
I believe the problem is two fold: one is that most Christians don’t want people to know that they still have sin in their life. On that note, they want non-believers to see them from a far as kinda holy. Not in a “I am above you: holy”, but kind of “God has redeemed me: holy”. If they get to close with people that don’t understand God’s grace it makes it hard for them to justify why they do what they do…. I think it can also convict them of their sin. The second is that they don’t want to be around non-Christians when they sin for reasons that they feel they either need to condemn or condole it. I have a bunch of different genre of friends; from non-believers (my Monday night Texas Hold’em guys) to Calvinist (they are best to mess with BTW). The way I have broken Jim’s philosophy is meeting everyone on common ground. Find out what it is that you and the other person have in common and build the relationship from there. Listen, Relate, and then Serve… When you can do this you are truly loving your neighbor and isn’t that what Jesus told us to do…
June 29, 2010 at 7:35 pm
Listen, relate, serve. Like that, too. Thanks Michael.
June 29, 2010 at 2:20 pm
I remember hearing Andy say once that “if Jesus were here today that he probably wouldn’t attend our church.” I took that to mean that he would be out in the world seeking the lost, the downtrodden and the forgotten. In my early experiences with church I found Christians to be a sort of “holier than thou” out of touch “bubble” crowd. Today as a maturing believer and follower of Christ I purpose myself to try and relate on some level with all of my non-Christian friends hoping that they see something in my life that is different and ask a question. Remember, you don’t have to engage in or condone behavior that doesn’t line up with the character of Jesus in order to be relevant to your n/c friends. Love em’ like Jesus.
June 29, 2010 at 2:26 pm
I actually do have friendships with people I do not consider having professed their faith in Christianity. However, they are “good people”, people who I see promise in, and people I respect. Therefore, my challenge is to be transparent, in that they know where I stand in my faith, and my participation in Christian fellowship. I want them to see a difference in me, not as a stagnant Christian, but as an active one. Living my faith. I invited one such friend to the Easter service, who was very concerned about attending as he was not sure he’d be accepted. He Loved It! Buckhead Church does a wonderful job of offering acceptance to those who are not yet sure or strong in their faith. So, in essence, I think we as Christians can have authentic relationships with nonChristians. IF – (big IF) – we have accountability and also set the appropriate guardrails. Living transparently. Perhaps the greatest thing I admire in Jesus Christ, is that he could humble himself in non-Christian settings and have such a graciousness, that even non-Christians wanted to be in his presence.
June 29, 2010 at 7:37 pm
We’re going to talk more about that in the next post. Thanks CJ.
June 29, 2010 at 2:37 pm
Im honored to be the designated provocateur. I’m a huge fan of Jeff and his team and I appreciate being given the opportunity to challenge,coerce or comfort you .
It’s apparent from some of your comments that several of you ” get it” about what bring transparent with the people Jesus misses most looks like.
It takes time, trust and openess
it means we are as open to their influence as we expect them to be ours
it means we ask them for advice, wisdom and insight on topics they are more experienced in than we are
it means we practice these three things
1) Being unusually interested in others ( Paul said to honor others above yourself)
2) Staying in the room with difference ( not running away or shunning those who disagree with our morals, politics or beliefs)
3) Refusing to compare my best with your worst ( dialog begins when one person “gives ground” and makes themself vulnerable – why shouldn’t followers of Jesus be the ones to model this)
Practice these three things and you will find yourself surrounded by Christians, Non Christians, Atheists and everyone in between
June 29, 2010 at 5:07 pm
Jim:
Excellent, excellent points.
I consider all my relationships with non-Christians to be authentic. I think partly because I am open to learning form them, but also because I don’t consider it my job to “save them.”
Remove that stressor from the relationship and it creates room for authenticity.
peace | dewde
June 29, 2010 at 7:37 pm
Dewde – you and Jim should have coffee sometime and let me sit an adjacent table and eavesdrop!
j
June 29, 2010 at 2:37 pm
I absolutely think it’s possible.
I do have authentic, transparent relationships with non-Christians, and I think one thing that helps is my blog. I don’t hide how hard it is, but I also don’t back down about what I believe.
I think another great example of this is the community that Los has built on his blog. Sure he has lots of church staffers and Christians who read and follow him, but he has a lot of non-believers in that community too. They’re sharpening each OTHER.
It IS possible, but you have to be intentional about it. We have to ALWAYS be on guard to make sure we’re not isolating ourselves AND that we’re not becoming like the world.
It is a complicated, difficult dance that can only be accomplished with surrender and transparency.
June 29, 2010 at 7:39 pm
True. It can definitely get messy. I talked about isolation last week in a blog about Google and China. Thanks for contributing to the dialogue, Johanna. I hope all is well in Minnesota!
June 29, 2010 at 2:52 pm
I agree with the author and think that most Christians can’t or don’t have transparent, authentic relationships with non-Christians? I also agree with Susan (above) that Christian to Christian relationships seem to lack transparency too. We only let a few people “into our world.” It’s safe, less vulnerable.
But in my small group, when we open up with others and share what is going on in our lives, the breakthroughs are amazing and special.
This challenges my thinking about doing the same with non-believers. Thanks Jeff.
June 29, 2010 at 3:01 pm
I think that many if not most Christians are incapable of having honest, transparent, authentic relatioships. First of all, we can’t with our Christian friends because we don’t want to be judged. Then, we have to “be a light” to our pre-Christian friends, so that means we have to show them (our interpetation of) what Jesus is like. Then because we have no people to be honest with, we can’t be honest with ourselves and consequently, God… It is an aweful conundrum.
June 29, 2010 at 3:01 pm
I think this is an excellent topic. I’ve been thinking about what someone told me once-
“we are called to have 2 conversions: 1, from the world to Christ, 2, with Christ, to the world.”
I’m personally finding the 2nd one to be difficult. It’s so easy to surround yourself with Christians, and to justify our need for community, discipleship, etc.
However, Jesus’ words “what reward is there if you only love those who love you” really call me on.
thanks for the thoughts
June 29, 2010 at 3:09 pm
Another book that I hear is really good on this topic is:
Total Church: A Radical Reshaping around Gospel and Community by Tim Chester and Steve Timmis.
I just purchased it the other day – haven’t read it yet but from my quick preview it looks good.
June 29, 2010 at 3:10 pm
I love this topic. I do think… as with most things… it is a matter of perspective. There is such a fine line, because we are all sinners. But really. It’s simple at the same time. Make a conscious effort to live the verse Micah 6:8. :)
June 29, 2010 at 3:11 pm
Maybe I shouldn’t admit this… but I find it easier to be transparent with my non-believing friends (and/or believing friends, but not practicing/church-going friends). They tend to be less judgemental. They accept me as a person, they accept my being a Christian, they accept me for me. I also accept them for who they are, be it homosexual, alcoholic, angry, etc. It is easy to love the person without loving their ailment/issue/religious preference.
I think when we accept them, we show them Christianity first hand. How are we any better than they are? Yes- we may be “saved” and have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ, and are going to heaven when we pass, but we are not better.
We are called to love these non/ halfway believers. Some of us were probably one of those “non-believer friends” and look where we are today… We LOVE Jesus as our personal Lord and Savior.
I don’t love the song I’m about to quote a line from, but I do love its message… “EVERYONE needs COMPASSION, the KINDNESS of a SAVIOR…”. I believe that we are the skin of Jesus here on earth. We have to love and engage with and be transparent with these non-believers to tear down the “religious” or “church” walls. They need to know that being a believer is not a building or a group of similar people or rules or fashion or popularity or money… it is simply a love story with a man named Jesus. We as believers are there to make the connection or the introduction.
June 29, 2010 at 7:40 pm
How true that sometimes (or many times) we’re more accepted by our non-believing friends than those who follow the Savior who brought us grace and forgiveness. Thanks Emily.
June 29, 2010 at 3:12 pm
Jim H. Thank you for your clarification here. I know some people including myself who are comfortable with just about anyone and then others that really struggle with it in a huge way. Jesus certainly appealed to the people that so many would have nothing to do with and I remember this when I look at how I interact with people. Sometimes I think those who are most comfortable and accepting are those who came from the “unthinkable” backgrounds of sin… because we know without a doubt how gracious God has been to us. Some transformations are so obvious like that of Saul/Paul.
June 29, 2010 at 9:07 pm
There are many overstatements on all sides of this. The heart is wicked and deceitful and unless we learn over time to get rid of the junk we will have difficulty communicating deeply with anyone, including a spouse. Deep sharing is developed by most of us through healing, learning skills and developing patience. The key to all of it is listening not talking.
June 30, 2010 at 12:05 am
This looks like a sermon in the making!
June 30, 2010 at 5:00 pm
These are all great conversations and ideas! My BLC small group is discussing this very thing right now in our “community” module (things like “Who is our Neighbor?” and what should Mercy look like if we are truly LIVING that out?). The 2 books we are reading now are “Ministries of Mercy” (Tim Keller) and “Strength to Love” (Martin Luther King, Jr.) and the are both great, but the BEST is “Strrength to Love”!! I would highly recommend that!
Carolyn Norton
July 1, 2010 at 4:42 pm
I loved the comments from dewede (and the head shot)
One of the comments a journalist made about me in a recent article in the June 28th edition of USA TODAY was that not only was I wanting to influence others but I was open to them influencing me.
While he meant it as a compliment I’m certain it causes concern among some of my fellow followers of Jesus.
But as Dewde says – if we want to have real conversations with the people Jesus misses most we cant “fake” it or “pretend” that we are openminded.
What happened to me when trying to love up to this standard was that I had to abandon “certainty” and replace it with “faith” which means I no longer say “I know” I say I “hope, trust, believe and have made a bet on Jesus” – who are you betting on?
Yes Mark Henderson (another relation to Jeff and me?) this is certainly sermon material
if you want to learn more about how I go about doing this kind of work check out my new book (just released today) called The Outsider Interviews – A DVB- DVD and Book – you can either Watch The Book or Read it
July 4, 2010 at 5:38 pm
[...] obstacles, nothing grows.” Blaine Hogan on The Gift of ObstaclesThe Power of Love“What most Christians can’t do is have transparent, authentic relationships with non-Christians….Should Christians Be Concerned for the Environment?“For a long time now, I’ve been convinced [...]
July 8, 2010 at 9:08 am
[...] Jeff Henderson was bothered by THIS conversation…and we should be as well! [...]
July 8, 2010 at 12:49 pm
That statement bothers me as well, because it is what we see most often. However, I disagree that this is always the case. Christians CAN have transparent, authentic relationships with non-Christians. We simply need to check our egos and fears at the door.
I have a bigger problem with this whole conversation that that statement, though. When did it become a good idea to ask non-Christians to evaluate the church? That’s like asking a non-Christian to rightly interpret Scripture. There are things about church that are offensive (and should be) to the world. Its one thing to welcome all people to worship with the body with the hope that they will meet Jesus there. It is something else entirely to ask someone who is not part of the body to critique it.
Blessings…
July 8, 2010 at 9:01 pm
I am a non believer. And I have yet to meet a christian willing to be in the same room with me. We may begin a friendship but the very second they hear I don’t believe, I am cut off forever. I attended two churches, and when asked to speak about myself, I mentioned that I am divorced, and those people literally stood up and moved away from me. I am a non believer because I never want to be like christians – self righteous, judgmental, haters of all things/people not like them. To us non believers, christians are the most bigoted haters on the planet. Deny it all you want. We experience your “love” and want nothing to do with it.
July 9, 2010 at 10:51 am
Debra
I m sorry for the treatment you received from us.
July 9, 2010 at 8:02 am
[...] last month, I had a great conversation with Jim Henderson and the Buckhead Church leadership team. http://blog.buckheadchurch.org/2010/06/29/a-conversation-that-bothered-me/ Jim used a phrase that immediately stuck with me, especially after reading Kevin’s book. Jim [...]
July 9, 2010 at 12:40 pm
I have very authentic and transparent relationships with a handful of non-Christians, but I am very quick to add that it is a credit to them!! Several are very spiritual and are as adamant in their faith as I am…and we enjoy the conversations.
I think the main thing that makes these relationships work is that neither side is pressing the other to convert. It’s not a competition…I don’t look at it as a challenge…it’s an opportunity to plant seeds and love them where they are.
Awesome post!!
July 10, 2010 at 12:23 am
It is true that Jesus spent most of His time rebuking religious people whose hearts were far from him. But remember the rich young ruler was not a pharisee, but a old time “Good Guy” who much like today thought his “good deeds” would make him acceptable to God. Jesus made it clear He needed to repent. Jesus was offensive to non-Christians who were unrepentant. Jesus was non-offensive to those who would repent. There is a fine line between being real with people and compromising the truths in Scripture that require biblical repentance. Some non-Christians will only be your friend if you don’t tell them they need to repent. All that being said, I don’t have it quite figured out …I had a transparent conversation with a non-Christian tonight who asked me, “What do you think about the fact that I am living with my girlfriend? Am I going to hell?” How am i supposed to respond?
July 10, 2010 at 12:28 am
The fact that all humans need to repent to escape the eternal judgment of God is offensive and demands and decision. Most non-Christians don’t want to hear that. How do you go from “I’m your friend” to “You will go to hell if you don’t repent”? without being offensive. In other words, when have we gone to far in watering down the gospel to the point that it has no power at all? I have been wrestling with this one for a while…
July 10, 2010 at 10:55 am
Don’t misunderstand; Many of us have faith in God and Jesus. It is the christians and church organizations we reject. I have been to several churches and they rejected me because I am divorced. I will never be a part of their organizations because their interest is always “what can you give/do for us”. They have their inner circles and nembies are made to know right up front they are not wanted. One time I attended a service, alone, sat down, and a woman came up and told me I was in her seat, please move. I moved, right out the door. A baptist church sent me a letter demanding, not inviting but demanding, I take some workshop about baptist doctrine and threatened me if I didn’t I would not be considered for membership, and I had only gone to that church one time. I was looking to join God’s church, not the Baptist club. I also found that services are now a show, a rock concert, a vegas act. Sound systems so loud it was painful. I saw nothing nor heard anything about finding Jesus, and this was the same in every church I tried. I asked for an appointment with a minister and was told “he is too busy”. I found the hatred of those not like them sad and I will never want to be like them.